Nikon vs Fuji model numbers

Discuss Nikon E2, E3 (incl. Fujix DS-505, 515 and 56x models), the original Nikon D1 and other discontinued Nikon DSLRs. Ask questions, post general comments, anecdotes, reviews and user tips.
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Stan Disbrow
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Nikon vs Fuji model numbers

Post by Stan Disbrow » Fri May 20, 2005 9:45 pm

Hi,

The Nikon E-series units were co-developed with Fuji and also sold under the Fuji brand name. Well, actually under the 'Fujix' variant of the Fuji brand name, but it's really the same thing to us at this point.

Here's a list of what eauls what in case anyone decides to go on a scavenger hunt for old DSLRs. :)

Nikon E2 = Fuji DS-505

Nikon E2s = Fuji DS-515

Nikon E2N = Fuji DS-505a

Nikon E2Ns = Fuji DS-515a

Nikon E3= Fuji DS-560

Nikon E3s = Fuji DS-565

Stan

Edit 1: Correction to the E3 to read DS-560 and E3s to read DS-565 (I had misremembered it as 565/565a instead of 560/565).

Edit 2: Correction to the correlation of the DS-505, 505a, 515 and 515a to their Nikon counterparts. I had the 'a' part wrong (read entire thread if you're curious about the process of getting it all straight!).

Stan
Last edited by Stan Disbrow on Mon Jun 06, 2005 5:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Serial Numbers

Post by Guest » Fri May 20, 2005 10:19 pm

Hi Stan,
Does the nikon E series share the same serial numbers as the Fujix Version :?:
Kiu

Stan Disbrow
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Serial Numbers

Post by Stan Disbrow » Mon May 23, 2005 5:22 pm

Hi,

I don't know if the Nikon serial numbers follow with the Fuji ones or not. This is a subject I've only begun to think about in the past week or so.

Heck, I don't know where the things were built. Were they all built in one plant? Was that at Nikon or Fuji? Or, did each company have a corner in a plant somewhere to make their own?

Actually, I strongly suspect that there was one production line. Having more than one for such a low volume product wouldn't make much economic sense. Since the development was joint, I suspect that the production was as well.

Based on my own development and manufacturing experience (25 years at IBM, GE, Ericsson and now Sony Ericsson), I'd say that the serial numbers were 'block allocated'.

This would mean that there would be a prefix for each brand and model in the matrix. There would be serial numbers assigned to each block, probably something like 200 each. If those ran out, then a new block would be assigned. If they weren't all used, then the ones remaining would never be assigned to anything at all.

With a scheme like this, there could also be prefix changes that followed a running design change that didn't qualify for a model number change. So, it would be possible to have more than one prefix for any given model number.

It is practically impossible to figure out all this without access to the production records from the factory. I say 'practically', because if we had enough owners of the cameras tell us what make/model/serial they have, we could eventually derive this information. Now, given the oddball status of the camera and it's market, I doubt that we could find enough owners of these things to get enough data points to tell.....

Heck, I'll be surprised if we come up with more than a couple dozen folks that own these things still. I bet most of them were sold for industrial use and were simply tossed into the scrap heap long ago.....

Stan
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Serial Numbers

Post by Webmaster » Mon May 23, 2005 6:20 pm

As some of you know, I'm collecting serial numbers from these cameras. I may never get enough to make much sense, but it's worth a try.

I plan to post my findings in another thread later. Not trying to be secretive or anything -- I simply need to collect my data.

I've recently experienced both a backup disk crash (250 GB external Maxtor drive), and a complete crash of my main PC (motherboard or CPU failure). I still have all my data intact, but it's not yet as easily accessible as it used to be..

Anyway, here are a few bits of information:

T TANAKA SA (Brazilian Nikon distributor):

"Actually those cameras were produced by Fuji with Nikon body. So, the distribution in Brazil were done by Fuji. We are the Nikon distributor and we have not sold those cameras. Please, contact Fuji Brasil: www.fujifilm.com.br"

Nikon UK:

"we are talking within the low hundreds across Europe"

Interfoto (Norwegian distributor):

No such cameras sold in Norway.

Nikon Sweden:

"I have asked the person in charge of our deliveries, and he says the camera has been sold in Sweden. But there is no statistics of how many of E2/E3 we have sold, it's too long ago."

I'll post all my serial numbers and further info later.

Jarle

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Re: Nikon vs Fuji model numbers

Post by Webmaster » Sun Jun 05, 2005 7:34 pm

Stan Disbrow wrote: Nikon E2s = Fuji DS-505a
Hi Stan,

Are you sure about this one? According to another source: 'The Fujix DS-515, also available from Nikon as the E2S..'

http://www.epi-centre.com/reports/9508cs.html

Take a look at these photos by Nathan Drummond:

http://www.nikonweb.com/baseplate/

I believe these are the correct model numbers:

Fujix 505A / Nikon E2N
Fujix 515 / Nikon E2s
Fujix 515A / Nikon E2Ns

Jarle

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Re: Nikon vs Fuji model numbers

Post by Stan Disbrow » Mon Jun 06, 2005 3:22 pm

Webmaster wrote:
Stan Disbrow wrote: Nikon E2s = Fuji DS-505a
Hi Stan,

Are you sure about this one? Jarle
Hi,

Yes. I'm quite sure that the list is correct now.

I just ran a search on Fuji's website and they list the the DS-505, DS-505a, DS-515, DS-515a, DS-560 and DS-565 as their four model numbers. These would correspond to Nikon's E2, E2s, E2N, E2Ns, E3 and E3s.

The fuji non-A models are the ones with no shot buffer, while the -A ones have said buffer and can shoot a 3 fps or so. The original model was the DS-505/505A, which would correspond to the Nikon E2/E2s, and the updated model was the DS-515/515A, which would correspond to the Nikon E2N/E2Ns.

Obviously, Fuji chose to use an 'A', and Nikon an 'S', suffix to denote the presence of the magical buffer memory chip. ;)

Originally, when I compiled the list, I goofed and carried that 'A' over to the third model series and called it out as the DS-565/565A, while Fuji had decided to drop the 'A' suffix and use DS-560/565 for the bufferless and buffered versions (which correspond to the Nikon E3 and E3s, where Nikon was still using the suffix letter that they'd used all along).

The first link you point to, I think has typo where he means' E2N', not 'E2S'. The second link is simply pointing out where the final version has the 'bump' on the bottom, where the SCSI interface parts are located.
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Re: Nikon vs Fuji model numbers

Post by Webmaster » Mon Jun 06, 2005 4:05 pm

Hi Stan,

I'm afraid I'll have to disagree. Take a look at this Fujifilm page:

http://home.fujifilm.com/info/products/ ... /spec.html

The DS-505A/515A are listed together. I still believe that DS-505A = E2N and 515A = E2Ns. Both share the same spec, except 'Continuous, high-speed shooting with the DS-515A'.

Also, DS-505 and DS-515 are listed on the same Fujifilm page (Release date: 1995-03-01):

http://www.fujifilm.co.uk/technical/folder.pl?id=39

These would be the original Nikon E2 and E2S.

Likewise, DS-560 / DS-565 are also listed on the same page (Release date: 1998-06-01):

Working to deliver all the promise of digital photography, Fujifilm engineers reworked key elements of the earlier DS-505A/DS-515A. The larger F4.8 aperture expands your creative opportunities, while the new built-in SCSI port is ready for fast, convenient downloads or output. Image quality is better than ever.

http://www.fujifilm.co.uk/technical/folder.pl?id=40

DS-560/565 obviously being the same as the newest Nikon E3 and E3S.

Here's 'my' complete list:

'First generation':

Nikon E2 = DS-505
Nikon E2s = DS-515

'Second generation':

Nikon E2N = DS-505A
Nikon E2NS = DS-515A

'Third generation':

Nikon E3 = DS-560
Nikon E3S = DS-565

In other words, the Fujifilm 'A' is not the same as Nikon's 'S'. In Fuji language, 'A' indicates a newer ('second generation') model (same as Nikon's 'N'). Confusing, but I think my list is now correct :o

Does this make any sense?

Thanks,
Jarle

Stan Disbrow
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Post by Stan Disbrow » Mon Jun 06, 2005 5:56 pm

Hi,

Yep. Looks like that makes more sense since Fuji has grouped the 'non-A' units on one page and the '-A' units on another. The other list that I was looking at listed them in order:

DS-505
DS-505a
DS-515
DS-515a
DS-560
DS-565

With these two pages from Fuji's site, I have to conclude that someone just ordered that other list numerically, not chronologically.

So, I'll just pop back up to the top and re-order my listing to match yours, where the Fuji 'A' equals the Nikon 'S' and the 505 is without buffer, and the 515 is with buffer. :)

Once again, we have apparantly unearthed some ancient facts from the ruins of manufacturer records. I draw the line, however, at long tunnels with large stone spheres that attempt to squash me like a bug! :P

Later!

Indy, er, Stan
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Nikon / Fujix model numbers

Post by Webmaster » Mon Jun 06, 2005 6:39 pm

Hi Indy,

Glad we could figure it out!

(Funny thing, I just saw one of the Indiana Jones movies again a few days ago!)

Jarle

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